Finished Pirate Planet last night and found the final part a huge letdown from an otherwise great story. I just think the huge pivot from The Captain to Xanxia as a villain doesn’t really land for me and it makes the final part a bit messy imo. Still a solid 4* with hilarious dialogue throughout
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Emotions are heightened during stressful situations.
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Ahhh, clearly a person with taste and refinement! I cannot express how much I adore this episode. Or… maybe I can? If you get chance, pop over to:
…and share your thoughts! 
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Very much agree with you. Also, some truly awful things have been said and written about a production team who clearly lavished love and attention on making the show. For all of the comments about Chibnall’s writing, putting an original script together for a show like DW is far from easy and, as with all modern showrunners, he shouldered the burden of that work. Moreover, he introduced some fantastic new voices and dared to make changes whilst still retaining the core of the show. He certainly didn’t play it safe. Much of the same, especially re: effort, passion and commitment, can be said of the rest of the core production team.
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I think that there are legitimate criticisms of this era, as with any era, and I would say that you can express them in a way that is reasonable. I am not a fan of Chibnall’s writing style and would have loved to have seen another showrunner during Jodie’s era. With this said, I don’t doubt that he is a great person who loves the show and did the best he could, and it obviously worked better for other people. I think it is important that you can have those opinions without being called wrong or that someone here should feel like it is hurtful.
This is the same for all eras. I love the current era and think the show is in the best state it has been in for many years. This is not something that everyone agrees with, and some people here say that the show is in the wrong hands and some don’t like Ncuti, but I don’t see this as wrong or hurtful; it is just different opinions. As long as you respect each other, that is a good thing.
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I watched AotC for the first time without knowing any of the references you mentioned (except Totters Lane) and I understood everything just fine, if that’s what you’re trying to say? I think you may be looking at it too much from a super-fan perspective. The general population wouldn’t care about some actor who played the cybercontroller, nor would they care that they don’t know what Telos is as long as the story is entertaining and at least somewhat comprehensible to watch “blind”. The serial spells everything out anyway. Even knowing Totters Lane isn’t that important to understand the story.
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I’m not saying it’s incomprehensible. Like you, I enjoy the story. I enjoy it quite a lot. What I’m saying, albeit it would appear less clearly than I’d have liked, is that I do feel the continuity references are not necessary to the story and don’t really contribute to the resolution of said story. I’m fine with them, though they don’t serve the story so far as I can see. They are gratuitous in the sense that they mostly aren’t required. Interestingly, one of the most successful bits of continuity (in my opinion of course) that I didn’t list in my original post, was the inclusion of Lytton. His inclusion is used in the plot in a fundamental and important way. The Doctor’s distrust of him becomes a key element. It is a lovely example of character exploration and a key early part of the arc that leads to the gradual softening of the Sixth Doctor’s portrayal. I absolutely see this as a strength of the story (and in contrast to the other examples I cited previously).
I happily concede. It’s difficult for me to approach it any other way. I can only look at it via the filter of my experience.
No, but they might pick up on the fact that he’s considerably more portly than any of the other cybermen. For a culture that is based on logic and improvement of the physical self, why is the Controller like this? It’s the sort of thing that provided an easy stick for people to beat the show with and justify their derision. It was a nice nod for the actor, but much more important if a) you can actually see and recognise said actor and b) they are playing a role where their acting can showcase the nuance and individuality they bring. I don’t think either of these things are true for the Cybercontroller in Attack. Similarly, with reference to Telos, it isn’t that its inclusion makes the story incomprehensible, merely that taken with everything else, it’s not necessary. I have no major quibble with it, but it’s just one more example. Not only Telos, but Mondas is also referenced. We, as fans, might care about this stuff but the truth is that most of the general audience simply don’t. And, it would appear, it’s been pretty thoroughly documented that the majority of the general audience didn’t find it that entertaining (however much that might be disappointing for us).
I think that’s also kind of my point. Yes, it does spell everything out. Comprehensibility isn’t my point. Gratuitous continuity IS the point. Totter’s Lane isn’t remotely important to the story. The Doctor’s remark that “This looks familiar”, whilst not a deal breaker for understanding the story, would make little sense to most of the audience given that the specific nature of that location plays zero role in the plot of the story.
Please don’t get me wrong. I do enjoy the story. Quite a lot, as it happens. I’m just commenting on my observations of the way that the continuity was handled (and it’s justification for being there at all).
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Subjecting myself to even more of the abysmal K-9 series 
Is there a thread for this I can’t seem to find one?
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Absolutely! I don’t think that general treatment of Chris Chibnall’s/Jodie’s era is hurtful or disrespectful at all on here. Sadly, the other website and most other places where DW gets discussed by ‘fans’, the same is not true. My comments refer specifically to that trend.
I love debating and discussing on here. Of course we all have differences. Sometimes, by reading other peoples posts, we find something new to enjoy about stories which might not have thrilled us as much previously. Sometimes it helps us enjoy our favourite stories even more. Sometimes, by having to engage our brains and think about why we like something that others are less keen on, it helps us appreciate it further still! Sometimes we will disagree - and all that’s fine provided (as you state so eloquently)…
Here here!
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Even though its important that the general audience understand what’s happening, why can’t the show include superfluous call-backs to elements only super-fans would pick up on? I think most shows with more than one season do that, and from my experience being or snooping around other fandoms, fans tend to enjoy easter eggs. They didn’t need to set pt 1 in Totters Lane, but I don’t think they were necessarily “wrong” for choosing that location (I use “wrong” lightly here because, as you said, you enjoyed the serial). The general audience goes “Oh, so he’s been in this junkyard before? Oh, what a barren planet” before promptly moving on, while the super-fans go “Woah! Unearthly Child! Lytton! Telos! Cybercontroller Michael!” In theory it was meant to be a draw-win scenario.
From what I’ve seen around the fandom, the bulk of complaints against AotC are about everything except the references. I just checked the TG ones, though, and one person said “How is a viewer from 1985 supposed to remember serials that haven’t been broadcast in 15 years?”. As I said in my first comment and in this one, the story was written so you don’t need to have that background knowledge to understand it, but if you do the serial should be all the more enhanced. This isn’t the only Classic story to have references to older serials, so I’m surprised there’s some gentle push-back with that. 
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I wasn’t referring to anything I’ve seen on here
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And you’re right, of course. I think the issue is with just how much it happened here. Easter eggs and fan references can be lovely when used in moderation. When made excessive (and what constitutes ‘excessive’ is very subjective, though it’s widely held that Attack is one of the most egregious examples of this), then it can be off putting. It is certainly the case that the perception at the time (and lingering for a good while afterwards) was that DW was becoming increasingly self referential in a way that a significant proportion of the casual audience found off putting. That’s all I’m saying. It isn’t that I don’t like it, but I can see why such criticisms exist and how they contributed to a negative perception of the show at the time. I don’t think the continuity references and nods in Attack are done as well as in many other stories.
Again, you are quite right. Indeed, continuity references were rife in the period. Consider the proportion of broadcast stories post season 19 that feature returning elements. The series increasingly relies on these throughout the JNT years (until Cartmel arrives and shakes things up). Some are done rather beautifully. Others, less so. Attack is often cited as the nadir in this regard.
Personally, I still think it’s an entertaining story but I can see what the general consensus was getting at. Sadly, I think the negative perception means that much that is good about this story goes unremarked.
Like you, I’m a big fan of Colin Baker’s two seasons (and even see stuff to enjoy in The Twin Dilemma - Shhh, don’t tell anyone I said that! 
). I can see some of the issues that others have, but I can also see so much that I love very much indeed!
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Watched The Invisible Enemy. It was alright.
…and that’s probably the most anyone has thought about this story in years. Seriously, this may be the most 6/10 episode put to screen. There’s a load of good ideas in there that don’t quite land - a zombie apocalypse base under siege thriller that goes Honey, I Shrunk The Kids mid way through that introduces K9 should be very interesting… but its just ok.
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I am happy to admit that I love it! I mean, it’s bonkers and we get a terribly realised monster, yet… I still love it!.
ISOLAYSHUN
EGSIT
I mean, language evolves. More phonetic spellings. Why the hell not? Who’s to say what the future holds? Considering how English has already evolved for the text generation, it isn’t so far fetched.
Oh, and the sheer monstrous ambition of the piece. The colossal chutzpah. Plus, the fact that it considers the right of a virus to exist as a virus. Pathogens have rights, folks! They are actually pretty central to evolution - one of the most important selective pressures. All part of the crucial richness of biodiversity. Humanity messes with that at its peril. Untold consequences. That’s all I’m saying! It’s an excellent and surprisingly deep point, made in a daffy and imaginative family show. Oh, and let’s not forget the fact that this story also offers a gentle critique of human expansionism when most stories just assume this is a good thing. There’s some quite modern critique here, albeit parcelled up in a whole heap of enjoyable nonsense. There’s a kind of genius in that.
I could go on.
Is it the best story? Not even close.
Is it a good story? Well, suffice to say that I don’t think it’s anywhere near as bad as often portrayed.
Do I love it?
Unreservedly!
Unasahamedly! 
Put it this way… “CONTACT HAS BEEN MADE!” 
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…well colour me shocked, we have here found one of the twelve Invisible Enemy superfans. Fair enough tbh.
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Wait until the rest of us come out of the woodwork!
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The thing is, when you use those kinds of expressions, it can make it a bit harder for others to share their opinions — not because they don’t have them, but because they might worry about hurting your or others’ feelings, and that’s not ideal either. I know that’s absolutely not what you meant, but that’s just how your comment came across to me. I really do love your enthusiasm for 13 and I want to keep seeing that, but I also want to hear why others didn’t connect with 13, since I find that interesting too.
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Reporting for duty 
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