So straight it loops back round to being extremely gay lmao
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I feel like it was trying to condemn toxic masculinity? Maybe?? But the conclusion the story comes to is that Owen has be even more macho and violent in order to âwinâ. That ending scene, for example.
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For me, that reads less as approval of toxic masculinity, moreso showing that despite the events, Owen still hasnât learnt his lesson.
Cyberwoman ends with Owen and Gwen naked together, I donât think thatâs approval of cheating, even if the story implies thatâs what Gwen seems to need in that moment, she also realises how wrong of her it is.
To me, itâs another step in his development, but yeah, I can see why it comes across how you read it
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I can also see how you read it like that. I think I came to that conclusion because I donât think the story presented Owenâs arc very well at all â it felt very simplistic to me, and in that final scene, it felt to me like the narrative was very much on Owenâs side. But that was just my impression!
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I agree with your take. But I think that is the case for how they handle Owen in general. He is a very problematic person, but he faces almost no consequences for that. The only consequence he has faced so far is from when he tried to be a good guy in the last episode. This is why I think that he is the worst character in the Whoniverse.
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My perspective on Owen comes from listening to a lot of his Big Finish stories before watching TV Torchwood, and in those stories I think heâs excellently characterised. Based off those I think heâs an excellent character (and I think his arc in s2, especially A Day in the Death, is also good!).
Hereâs a quote from Iceberg which I recently listened to that reveals a lot about Owen, I think (minor spoilers for Fragments:)
AMIRA: I couldnât understand how you just cut me off like that!
OWEN: Because I had to! Because Katie died, and I had to become the sort of person who couldnât feel it. Okay?
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I have only seen him on TV. But to me his arc in season 2 is just too little to late.
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I think most things from Torchwood become 1000 times better if you pretend Series One didnât happen.
And one of those things is Owen.
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Iâm starting to think some of you guys just donât like Torchwood and would be happier not watching it for TV Club.
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It has been feeling quite negative to me.
As a fan of the show (I say âfanâ, Iâm on only I series 2 but Iâm really enjoying it) it is a bit sad
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Yeah, itâs one of my favourite parts of the Whoniverse and seeing so much negativity and complaining in these threads hasnât been fun.
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Iâm not sure thatâs fair. I donât think itâs that controversial to say that Series 1 isnât particularly rated highly by fandom. And I think everyone commenting is giving reasons rather than just saying âitâs shitâ and moving on.
And actually, I think thereâs been some pretty positive feedback for some episodes like Countrycide, Out of Time and They Keep Killing Suzie.
And the point is, people are still watching it and wanting to give it a chance because of TV Club so, surely, that can only be a positive. No one is beholden to love it though and I donât think itâs fair to say people would be happier not watching it. TARDIS Guide is a place of open minds.
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I love Torchwood, the audios are probably my favourite Big Finish range because they are so often consistently brilliant, but even I find lots of holes to pick in S1 and S2 of the TV show.
S3 is perfect, however, and S4, while flawed, has lots to love.
I wonât stand for all this Ianto bashing though! Heâs adorable, stop it!!
(I can barely remember what happens in this episode, havenât caught up with the rewatch yet)
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Here are my thoughts on this story from when I watched it back in September:
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Not a fan of discount âFight ClubââŚ
I donât even like the original âFight ClubââŚ
I am not sure if Iâve said this elsewhere, but Weevil is a ridiculous nameâŚ
Are they a small evil, are they small and evil or are they evil and always in search of a lavatory? 
Best part of Torchwood for me as well 
Is being bland adorable these days? 
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It was the same for many with the TV Club for season 2 of the modern show (something that I like). It is part of the interesting thing with the TV Club that people who normally donât write about stuff give their thoughts. As long as they give reasons and are respectful, there is nothing wrong with that. I would love to read what you think is great about this episode.
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