I’ve heard a theory (I think from Toby Hadoke on his Happy Times and Places) that Ursula wasn’t really there, and he’s hallucinating with just a blank slab. What the episode is showing is what he’s seeing and hearing.
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Yeah, my dad’s a big ELO fan so I’ve been listening to it throughout my childhood…
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Another ELO fan here, but I’m not as much of a Time fan, though I don’t dislike it. When they ditched the “Orchestra” part of their sound is when I thought they kinda fell off a bit. My favorite album is probably Out of the Blue.
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Fair enough. It’s got some songs on it like Yours Truly, 2095 that I really like, and they may very well be carrying the rest.
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I think when we see the slab from the in-universe camera’s POV, it’s only ever the back of the slab too.
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lol should I merge this with TV Club: Love & Monsters ?
I remember @LaminatedChicken
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Until I started going on the Doctor Who side of the internet, I had no idea that “Love and Monsters” was so widely hated when everyone in my family (including me) either likes it or is indifferent towards it. I think having an episode focusing on ordinary people whose lives that the Doctor has changed or know about what he does that were never companions is a fascinating concept for the episode. My only real problem with it is that the Abzorbaloff is probably my least favorite Doctor Who villain of all time, but I like the rest of the episode.
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Dammit, RTD2, for robbing L&M of something unique!
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To add some of my Thoughts to it:
Yes it’s a good Episode, could it have been much better with such a great Concept? Yeah. But what we got is still pretty good.
No, I disagree, the Abzorbaloff is a great Monster and I will fight for this Point. I mean, if it wasn’t such a good one, would we still be talking about it today? Probably not, SEE POINT PROVEN!!
I would say it would make sense to do so, the more Love for that Episode in that thread the merrier, right? 
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I had the same exact thought when this thread got bumped!
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The Abzorbaloff is fine, considering it was invented by and based off of the drawing of a child. I believe it was originally imagined as much larger, but it’s pretty much realized as the kid had drawn. It’s no goofier than any number of other Who monsters that aren’t as commonly panned.
Now, if Kay’s performance isn’t to one’s taste, that’s a different matter, but I thought he was fine. I think he’s a bit better as “Victor Kennedy.” Maybe he was little much once the façade was gone, but honestly not too much I don’t think though.
Despite being half the title, the monster isn’t really that important to the story, what is important is the character piece on Elton, and the story of how the Doctor can affect the ordinary people around them, either directly or indirectly. Not to mention the meta examination of Doctor Who fandom itself, and the kind of damage more toxic elements of that fandom can do. I think all of these things are done very well.
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Another “do I still hate this?” rewatch, and another case of me coming around on the episode. And honestly, I owe all of that to the community here at TARDIS Guide. Not for what anyone else has specifically said about the episode in question, but the community itself.
I’ve been a Who die-hard since I was a kid, but aside from one or two friends and family members who also watched the show, I never really had like a group of people I could just geek out with about all this. And bear in mind that I’m a child of the internet, so it’s not as if online discussions were entirely out of the question for me. I just… never found one until now.
Through that lens, I recognised a lot of LINDA from the many faces I’ve been chatting/arguing with around here. The amateur investigating, the theories on top of theories, the fan creations, even discussions of when to maybe give the show a break if you’re only in it for the sake of compulsion. I vibed with it a lot more this time around because… well, I now realise how much I like being in that kind of atmosphere.
Victor Kennedy in particular hits way differently in the era of RIPDoctorWho. This smug, domineering blob that pulls in those who genuinely care about the show and its stories, creating this ugly mass that only serves to aggrandise the ego and motives of the ones pulling everyone else around.
The performances are quite good here as well. Marc Warren as Elton is remarkably likeable and relatable, Ursula is played by Shirley Henderson and thus amazing by default, Peter Kay works a treat as Victor Kennedy (and okay-ish as the Abzorbaloff), and Camille Coduri is at her best with this one.
Then there’s the ending, the thing that I spent so long hearing about as the moment when this became the worst episode of the whole show for some. And for a while, I was one of them; something didn’t sit well with the idea of the Doctor condemning someone to be a slab of concrete forever, like a demented parody of pro-life messaging. I’ve always been fine with that joke, but the circumstances around it, not so much.
But then something Elton said struck me on this latest rewatch: “I don’t care what anyone thinks. I love her.” Those are the words of someone who, if Ursula had any objections to her new state of life, likely would’ve assisted however he could because that’s how pure their relationship is. Hell, with how forceful Ursula is in the episode proper, she doesn’t come across as someone who would just let things go if she wasn’t content with how she is at the end.
I still think the episode overall shows as an early and unrefined experiment in Doctor-lite/companion-lite narrative composition, and the Abzorbaloff still doesn’t do much for me as a monster, both in design and in motivation. But overall… yeah, I like it. Rewatching this felt like a personal growth mile marker.
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A lovely review, @Mahan.
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I’m not a big fan of this episode honestly, but I absolutely agree it’s overhated. There are definitely things to like in it. I think it’s easily Jackie Tyler’s best episode for example. But I honestly feel it completely falls apart at the end. Couple of random thoughts I have, not sure if anyone agrees but I’m inclined to share.
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Once the Absorbaloff is revealed, does anyone else think that Peter Kay’s performance basically just become an impression of Fat Bastard from the Austin Powers movies? I kept thinking this and I found it very distracting.
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I think that an argument can be made that this episode is at it’s best when it’s furthest away from being a Doctor Who episode. That’s not a criticism btw. In fact I think this episodes willingness to stray so far from the expected is to be commended. I just think that in general the more aliens/sci-fi stuff going on in the episode, the less enjoyable it becomes.
This might explain why some fans hate it so much. When this episode leans into sci-fi and is more traditionally Doctor Who, it can be… well it can be the Absorbaloff. When this episode is really charming and sweet there’s probably not an alien in sight. The really good stuff isn’t being good at what some fans want from an episode of Doctor Who. The stuff that these fans want from an episode of Doctor Who hasn’t got a lot of good stuff. Wherever they’re looking, this episode probably fails to meet some of their expectations.
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This story isnt as terrible tbh.
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